[time-nuts] Datum / Efratom LPRO 101 - ebay

bbobb mokai nhbbobb at gmail.com
Thu Apr 2 21:27:37 UTC 2009


hi,i am fluke.l. About Mr.TVB's photos on my ebay listings.sorry for
these surprise.
if Tom ask me for any copyright problem,i will remove them.i think,tom has
deal with me twice in last early year ,he also have no ask me to removed
them.
Regards
Bob



2009/4/2 <time-nuts-request at febo.com>

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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR) (John Ackermann N8UR)
>   2. Re: PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR) (Bruce Griffiths)
>   3. Re: Datum / Efratom LPRO 101 - ebay (Magnus Danielson)
>   4. Re: PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR) (Tom Van Baak)
>   5. Re: PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR) (John Ackermann N8UR)
>   6.  Austron 2100F (Claude Houde)
>   7. Frequency Divider (Brian Kirby)
>   8. Re: Frequency Divider (Bruce Griffiths)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2009 17:56:46 -0400
> From: John Ackermann N8UR <jra at febo.com>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR)
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D3E31E.4090906 at febo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> You could probably get those output frequencies with a custom version of
> the PIC code.  There shouldn't be any hardware changes needed, though
> the circuit board layout wasn't optimized for high frequencies so no
> guarantee on 5 MHz.
>
> The PIC source code will be available, so anyone who wants to modify it
> for other outputs can have at it.
>
> John
> ----
>
> Mitchell Janoff said the following on 04/01/2009 05:37 PM:
> > In your post, you mentioned that the TADD-2, will have six low impedance
> > outputs that can be individually jumpered to 1 PPS or 10 Hz through 10
> kHz
> > outputs. I was wondering if there was a way to provide outputs of 100k,
> 1MHz
> > and 5MHz (assuming a 10MHz source). I am looking for a way to use a
> single
> > source such as a z3801 as the standard for my various counters and
> clocks.
> > There was also a post to build this using divide by 10,2 and 5 IC's. If
> > someone is going to build this circuit can they provide the schematic? If
> > there multiple people interested we can have a circuit board created for
> > this project.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Mitch
> > KC2MFB
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2009 11:11:06 +1300
> From: Bruce Griffiths <bruce.griffiths at xtra.co.nz>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR)
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D3E67A.6010509 at xtra.co.nz>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> John
>
> Providing a 5MHz output will be difficult/impossible if the PIC is
> clocked at 10MHz as a pin will have to be toggled with every instruction.
> Surely this will leave no time for executing other instructions to
> produce other output frequencies?
>
> It may be possible to do this using inline code with no conditional
> branches if and only if one can loop back to the start of the code
> without requiring an extra cycle.
> It would probably be easier to use a dedicated hardware divider
> (external flipflop or internal timer) to generate the 5MHz output.
>
> Bruce
>
> John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> > You could probably get those output frequencies with a custom version of
> > the PIC code.  There shouldn't be any hardware changes needed, though
> > the circuit board layout wasn't optimized for high frequencies so no
> > guarantee on 5 MHz.
> >
> > The PIC source code will be available, so anyone who wants to modify it
> > for other outputs can have at it.
> >
> > John
> > ----
> >
> > Mitchell Janoff said the following on 04/01/2009 05:37 PM:
> >
> >> In your post, you mentioned that the TADD-2, will have six low impedance
> >> outputs that can be individually jumpered to 1 PPS or 10 Hz through 10
> kHz
> >> outputs. I was wondering if there was a way to provide outputs of 100k,
> 1MHz
> >> and 5MHz (assuming a 10MHz source). I am looking for a way to use a
> single
> >> source such as a z3801 as the standard for my various counters and
> clocks.
> >> There was also a post to build this using divide by 10,2 and 5 IC's. If
> >> someone is going to build this circuit can they provide the schematic?
> If
> >> there multiple people interested we can have a circuit board created for
> >> this project.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Mitch
> >> KC2MFB
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> >> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> >> and follow the instructions there.
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2009 00:11:17 +0200
> From: Magnus Danielson <magnus at rubidium.dyndns.org>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Datum / Efratom LPRO 101 - ebay
> To: Tom Van Baak <tvb at leapsecond.com>,  Discussion of precise time and
>        frequency measurement <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D3E685.6010708 at rubidium.dyndns.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Tom Van Baak skrev:
> >> I notice that this seller is using TVB's plots on his listing. This is a
> bit naughty. Did he ask you Tom?
> >
> > No, he didn't ask. I was a little surprised too.
>
> Me too. I saw just from the first plot that it should be one of Toms. At
> least you are credited, so it is not a total rip-off. On the other hand,
> it is somewhat a sign of recognition... again.
>
> Cheers,
> Magnus
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 16:09:16 -0700
> From: "Tom Van Baak" <tvb at LeapSecond.com>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR)
> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <238B295422F5472D822FB97207A176B1 at pc52>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>        reply-type=original
>
> Mitch,
>
> Ah, I can see a new TADD idea: a multi-purpose 2x multiplier
> or 2x divider, or 5x and 10x too.
>
> In your case, though, perhaps you could add a single flip-flop
> to a TADD-2 to get 5 MHz from 10 MHz, the old-fashioned way.
>
> You can't divide by two on a PIC because the minimum loop
> is a couple of instructions and each instruction takes 4 clock
> cycles. For those of you who know PIC code, the upper limit
> is the one mentioned by Bruce where pairs of instructions set
> and clear an output pin and then the entire memory is those
> pairs. The instruction counter quietly wraps around avoiding
> the need for a branch instruction. The result is a divide by 8
> counter (2 instructions times 4 clocks per instruction). Ulrich,
> I assume the AVR is better in this respect (with a 1:1 clock vs.
> cycle count?). Of course, if you add any programming at all
> you can't use the wrapping-pair trick.
>
> Anyway, that's why all the PIC dividers you see specialize in
> lower frequencies, from very sub-Hz to Hz to maybe several
> 100 kHz.
>
> /tvb
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bruce Griffiths" <bruce.griffiths at xtra.co.nz>
> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <
> time-nuts at febo.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 3:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR)
>
>
> > John
> >
> > Providing a 5MHz output will be difficult/impossible if the PIC is
> > clocked at 10MHz as a pin will have to be toggled with every instruction.
> > Surely this will leave no time for executing other instructions to
> > produce other output frequencies?
> >
> > It may be possible to do this using inline code with no conditional
> > branches if and only if one can loop back to the start of the code
> > without requiring an extra cycle.
> > It would probably be easier to use a dedicated hardware divider
> > (external flipflop or internal timer) to generate the 5MHz output.
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> > John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> >> You could probably get those output frequencies with a custom version of
> >> the PIC code.  There shouldn't be any hardware changes needed, though
> >> the circuit board layout wasn't optimized for high frequencies so no
> >> guarantee on 5 MHz.
> >>
> >> The PIC source code will be available, so anyone who wants to modify it
> >> for other outputs can have at it.
> >>
> >> John
> >> ----
> >>
> >> Mitchell Janoff said the following on 04/01/2009 05:37 PM:
> >>
> >>> In your post, you mentioned that the TADD-2, will have six low
> impedance
> >>> outputs that can be individually jumpered to 1 PPS or 10 Hz through 10
> kHz
> >>> outputs. I was wondering if there was a way to provide outputs of 100k,
> 1MHz
> >>> and 5MHz (assuming a 10MHz source). I am looking for a way to use a
> single
> >>> source such as a z3801 as the standard for my various counters and
> clocks.
> >>> There was also a post to build this using divide by 10,2 and 5 IC's. If
> >>> someone is going to build this circuit can they provide the schematic?
> If
> >>> there multiple people interested we can have a circuit board created
> for
> >>> this project.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>>
> >>> Mitch
> >>> KC2MFB
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2009 19:32:40 -0400
> From: John Ackermann N8UR <jra at febo.com>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] PPS Divider (John Ackermann N8UR)
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D3F998.5080009 at febo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
> Hi Bruce --
>
> Good point; I'll leave it to the software guys to figure that out. :-)
>
> John
> ----
>
> Bruce Griffiths said the following on 04/01/2009 06:11 PM:
> > John
> >
> > Providing a 5MHz output will be difficult/impossible if the PIC is
> > clocked at 10MHz as a pin will have to be toggled with every instruction.
> > Surely this will leave no time for executing other instructions to
> > produce other output frequencies?
> >
> > It may be possible to do this using inline code with no conditional
> > branches if and only if one can loop back to the start of the code
> > without requiring an extra cycle.
> > It would probably be easier to use a dedicated hardware divider
> > (external flipflop or internal timer) to generate the 5MHz output.
> >
> > Bruce
> >
> > John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> >> You could probably get those output frequencies with a custom version of
> >> the PIC code.  There shouldn't be any hardware changes needed, though
> >> the circuit board layout wasn't optimized for high frequencies so no
> >> guarantee on 5 MHz.
> >>
> >> The PIC source code will be available, so anyone who wants to modify it
> >> for other outputs can have at it.
> >>
> >> John
> >> ----
> >>
> >> Mitchell Janoff said the following on 04/01/2009 05:37 PM:
> >>
> >>> In your post, you mentioned that the TADD-2, will have six low
> impedance
> >>> outputs that can be individually jumpered to 1 PPS or 10 Hz through 10
> kHz
> >>> outputs. I was wondering if there was a way to provide outputs of 100k,
> 1MHz
> >>> and 5MHz (assuming a 10MHz source). I am looking for a way to use a
> single
> >>> source such as a z3801 as the standard for my various counters and
> clocks.
> >>> There was also a post to build this using divide by 10,2 and 5 IC's. If
> >>> someone is going to build this circuit can they provide the schematic?
> If
> >>> there multiple people interested we can have a circuit board created
> for
> >>> this project.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>>
> >>> Mitch
> >>> KC2MFB
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> >>> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> >>> and follow the instructions there.
> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> >> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> >> and follow the instructions there.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2009 21:30:15 -0400
> From: Claude Houde <va2hdd at aei.ca>
> Subject: [time-nuts]  Austron 2100F
> To: time-nuts at febo.com
> Message-ID: <49D41527.1000201 at aei.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi everybody !
>
> Thanks for your fast answers.
>
> If I can resume it is OK to buy the 2100F, but at a bargain price as it
> may be a really tough job to bring it back to life.
>
> Thanks also for the user's manual source, I will order it to start
> troubleshooting.
>
> Again thanks and best regards !
>
> 73 from Claude VA2HDD
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2009 21:17:13 -0500
> From: Brian Kirby <kilodelta4foxmike at gmail.com>
> Subject: [time-nuts] Frequency Divider
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D42029.3000304 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Maybe we all could come up with a separate new board to take 10 Mhz and
> give us 5 Mhz and 1 Mhz out.
>
> Start with a buffer amp and then a decent Schmidt trigger.  Feed it to a
> symmetrical divide by 2 for 5 Mhz, and a symmetrical dive by 10 for 1
> Mhz.  These out puts could be buffered with 74AC04 for TTL.  Another set
> of outputs could be derived and filtered to give sine wave outputs.
>
> It seems the crowd is against 7490s, and 74390s - and I would like to
> know what the crowd recommends as suitable.
>
> Brian KD4FM
>
> John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> > Hi Bruce --
> >
> > Good point; I'll leave it to the software guys to figure that out. :-)
> >
> > John
> > ----
> >
> > Br
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2009 15:49:32 +1300
> From: Bruce Griffiths <bruce.griffiths at xtra.co.nz>
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Frequency Divider
> To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement
>        <time-nuts at febo.com>
> Message-ID: <49D427BC.20507 at xtra.co.nz>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Brian
>
> Ideally one would use something like a Johnson counter or a Grey code
> counter, decode the required outputs and then resynchronise the decoded
> outputs using a set of dedicated flipflops.
> Since such counters only change the state of one flipflop at a time it
> is possible to avoid decoding glitches.
> The resynchronisation flipflops minimise the clock to output delay and
> its associated tempco as well as minimise the jitter.
> Although the decoders can have glitch free outputs there will be some
> edge delay patterns that repeat every ten input clock periods.
>
> If one is using a set of retiming/resynchronisation flipflops then
> decoder deglitches are relatively unimportant as they are eliminated by
> the retiming flipflops.
>
> One could use a 74HC4017 and produce the 5MHz output as:
>
> 5MHz = Q0 +Q2+ Q4 + Q6 + Q8
> which will be glitch free.
> However resynchronisation will be necessary to minimise periodic
> variations in edge delay for this output.
>
> 1MHz = Carry Out
>
>
> Bruce
>
> Brian Kirby wrote:
> > Maybe we all could come up with a separate new board to take 10 Mhz and
> > give us 5 Mhz and 1 Mhz out.
> >
> > Start with a buffer amp and then a decent Schmidt trigger.  Feed it to a
> > symmetrical divide by 2 for 5 Mhz, and a symmetrical dive by 10 for 1
> > Mhz.  These out puts could be buffered with 74AC04 for TTL.  Another set
> > of outputs could be derived and filtered to give sine wave outputs.
> >
> > It seems the crowd is against 7490s, and 74390s - and I would like to
> > know what the crowd recommends as suitable.
> >
> > Brian KD4FM
> >
> > John Ackermann N8UR wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Bruce --
> >>
> >> Good point; I'll leave it to the software guys to figure that out. :-)
> >>
> >> John
> >> ----
> >>
> >> Br
> >>
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> > To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> > and follow the instructions there.
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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