[time-nuts] US ebay sellers who won't ship outside the US

[Jim Palfreyman]

Don't forget books are not covered under ITAR.

That's how the original PGP got distributed legally.

Jim

2009/7/16 Robert Atkinson <robert8rpi at yahoo.co.uk>

>
> Hi,
> I've been on the receiving end of this and it's getting worse. Even data is
> restricted under ITAR (international Traffic in Arms Regulations). It's
> frustrating to have to get a licence (that can take months) just to get a
> official copy of installation manual for a radio even when a copy of the
> maintenance manual can be freely downloaded from the US governments own
> website! (and the radio bought on ebay) Some of the bigger surplus dealers
> have been warned and face going to jail for further violations. It's very
> hard to tell what and what is not restricted. A helmet is probably not
> restricted, but if it has a bracket on the front that might be used to mount
> night vision equipment then it is! And big brother IS watching ebay, I have
> personal experience of this.
>
> Robert G8RPI.
>
> --- On Thu, 16/7/09, Robert Darlington <rdarlington at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > From: Robert Darlington <rdarlington at gmail.com>
> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] US ebay sellers who won't ship outside the US
> > To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" <
> time-nuts at febo.com>
> > Date: Thursday, 16 July, 2009, 4:56 AM
> > Having personally worked on the
> > government side of these export regulations,
> > I can assure you they were developed with good
> > intentions.  The problem is
> > that Uncle Sam doesn't realize that vintage 1980s
> > technology of the USA is
> > not much of a threat to national security when placed in
> > the hands of the
> > folks in the UK (and most of the rest of the
> > world).   I find it amusing
> > that I cannot export precision timing equipment to China,
> > but have no
> > problem buying the exact same regulated equipment from a
> > vendor in China
> > through eBay.  I also find it to be pretty sad, but
> > that's a whole other
> > topic!
> >
> > -Bob
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 15, 2009 at 6:19 PM, <EWKehren at aol.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > You have it all wrong. Having friends in the business,
> > I can tell you what
> > > is going on. The reason the larger dealers have the
> > restriction is, that
> > > some or  most of their products come from
> > companies that do business with
> > > the
> > > government.  They are forced by contract to
> > restrict sales to US addresses
> > > only and are  presently facing ways to even make
> > it more restrictive.
> > > Government agencies  audit these sellers and
> > violations as a minimum
> > > results in
> > > loss of  business. To reduce that risk and not
> > having to account for what
> > > came
> > > from  where, many sellers opt for total "no
> > foreign sales".  Intentional
> > > circumvention of that restriction can result in
> > prosecution. Be  cageful.
> > > Don't
> > > ask me what I think of the governments actions.
> > > Bert Kehren WB5MZJ
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 7/15/2009 6:40:05 P.M. Eastern
> > Daylight Time,
> > > jmay at impulse.adsl24.co.uk
> > writes:
> > >
> > > Blimey  Jim, you're a patient man!  To be
> > fair most individual sellers
> > > are  happy enough to ship abroad if you ask them,
> > it's the bigger dealers
> > > who seem to have rules carved in granite tablets...
> > >
> > > Jim  Palfreyman wrote:
> > > > John,
> > > >
> > > > I had the same problem from  Australia. And
> > when they did ship the
> > > postage
> > > > would be more than the  unit! I had to wait
> > and wait and wait. Finally
> > > (after
> > > > years) a good  seller who packed well,
> > priced well put one up and I won.
> > > >
> > > >  Even if no one takes up your offer - if you
> > do wait one will turn up.
> > > >
> > > > It's even worth asking them if they say not
> > outside the US. Some  don't
> > > offer
> > > > because they think no one would pay $100 for
> > postage -  when in fact we
> > > > would.
> > > >
> > > > Jim
> > > >
> > > > 2009/7/16  John May <jmay at impulse.adsl24.co.uk>
> > > >
> > > >> I'm in the UK  and am often frustrated
> > when a nice piece of kit is
> > > offered
> > > >> for  sale on the 'bay by dealers in the
> > US who won't ship overseas.
> > > I've
> > > >> been looking for an HP 5370B and have lost
> > out on a few nice  looking
> > > units
> > > >> because of this.  There's one sitting
> > there  just now just to tease me!
> > > >>
> > > >> Is there anyone on the list  who'd be
> > willing to act as an intermediary
> > > >> (take delivery and  resend) to
> > circumvent this?
> > > >>
> > > >> I'd certainly be prepared  to help in a
> > similar manner any stateside
> > > >> time-nut frustrated at  EU sellers who
> > won't ship outside Europe (could
> > > help
> > > >> reduce  customs fees as well by marking
> > as returned from repair   etc.)
> > > >>
> > > >> Regards -  JM
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
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