[time-nuts] Thunderbolt stability and ambient temperature

Chuck Harris cfharris at erols.com
Mon Jun 15 13:19:14 EDT 2009

Joseph M Gwinn wrote:
> I was the one who originally rained on the use-water-in-a-bottle approach. 
>  The response was that even a child could store water.  Well, that is not 
> the common experience with water-cooled equipment, which always manages to 
> require continual maintenance attention, so I went quiet, and listened as 
> the subject was explored. 

But it isn't necessary to get this complicated.  You don't need moving parts,
and I agree, you don't want to be piping the stuff around.

The increasingly complex schemes are coming about because posters are
trying to invent reasons why this is hard work.  They are ignoring the
simple fact that small quantities of water can be easily stored for a whole
lot of years.

A couple of examples from my own life:  I live on well water.  If the
electricity goes out, and it regularly does, I cannot pump the water to
flush the toilets.  That goes over really well with my wife.  To avoid
this problem I keep three 5 gallon plastic jugs of water in the basement.
They sit there for very long periods of time, and are invariably full when
I need them to force a manual flush.  Simple!

Don't like plastic water jugs?  Ok, use a 5 gallon plastic paint pail.  They
are O-ring sealed, and will stay full of water for a decade or more without
any attention.  I have one in my basement that I used for cooling water when
I was soldering the plumbing in my house... 5 years ago.  It is open, with
a lid just sitting on top.  The pale is still full of water.  Some evaporation
has undoubtedly occurred, but not enough to matter.  Things would be much
better if I bothered to snap the lid down... actually things would be much
better if I bothered to dump the water and cleaned out the pail... I think
I might.

For me, processing a junk automobile engine so that I would A) want it
in my house, and B) would be able to use it as a ballast is ridiculous.
The stupid things cost $50 to $100 in the junk yard, and are a really
inconvenient shape.  I'd much rather stack $50, or $100 worth of polyethylene
chemical bottles full of water than mess with a junk engine.

> It has become apparent from the issues and increasingly complex schemes to 
> solving tose issues that keeping water in its place is not exactly child's 
> play, and it seems to me that water is far more trouble and even expense 
> than simply getting a big hunk of scrap metal, unless one needs tons of 
> thermal mass.  If one needs fast thermal exchange with the air, drill some 
> holes or use a set of thick plates with spacers, so the distance from air 
> to the most remote part of the mass is no more than an inch or so.  Or, 
> use a big hunk of copper or aluminum.  Or both.

Have you even looked at the price of copper lately?  It is so high that
even the rich cannot afford to use it for flashing, gutters or roofs
anymore!  And when you are all done, copper and aluminum cannot store the
same amount of heat, pound-for-pound, as plain old dumb water.
> If one needs tons of thermal mass plus rapid exchange with the air, use 
> brick checkerwork or a pebble bed, a standard industrial approach: <

That can be a good way too.  How are you going to keep it dry and mold free?

What about the ever present dust?

-Chuck Harris

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