[time-nuts] "The GPS navigation is the weakest point,"

gary lists at lazygranch.com
Thu Dec 15 19:23:33 EST 2011


It is composite, not metal.

If you know what you are doing, composites are extremely tough. I don't 
know if graphite is kosher on a stealth plane. I have to assume it is 
S-2 glass or similar nonconductive composites. But if graphite were 
allowed, you would be amazed at how much abuse it could take.


On 12/15/2011 4:15 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> All I can say is that the sheet metal on that drone looks really good.
>   I doubt it ran out of fuel.
>
> They either landed it which would require very high level spoofing
> ability or like I said use something like a butterfly net on it.   The
> metal is just to straight for a crash.
>
>
> On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 3:44 PM, gary<lists at lazygranch.com>  wrote:
>> I've talked to the GPS jammers at Nellis and have seen their gear. They
>> don't spoof but just jam. The gear is totally COTS. Some Marconi signal
>> generator that can generate white noise at the two GPS frequencies. They
>> have omni or directional antennas. They have an old Russian jammer on hand,
>> but the Marconi works a lot better.
>>
>> I've been jammed by them. It is interesting in that the GPS just suddenly
>> dies. That is, it seems to track given some noise, but you hit a point where
>> it suddenly gives up. It is the only time I've seen no satellites shown on
>> the display.
>>
>> It wouldn't surprise me if a Growler could spoof a GPS, but I have no hard
>> evidence that it can.
>>
>> I'm in agreement with they just jammed everything and the thing ran out of
>> fuel. I have a FOIA somewhere on a Predator crash. With LOS, it just orbits.
>> In the case of this Predator, it orbited into a mountain near Creech AFB.
>>
>>
>> On 12/15/2011 3:18 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
>>>
>>> I bet this drone contains no technology that is not exportable.  Of
>>> course they had to think about a crash.
>>>
>>> I also bet it had an inertial nav system as backup to the GPS.   But
>>> and this is the key to all backups.  You have to know the primary is
>>> failed.   When you jam GPS the smart way is not to over power it with
>>> white noise but to first transmit an IDENTICAL signal.  Then very
>>> slowly move your stronger signal away from "truth" until it is sending
>>> a false signal.   This way the receiver does not know it is being
>>> jammed.  No I did not just think of this, it's what "everyone" does.
>>>   But why then if the INS and GPS disagree was there not an alarm?   It
>>> was likely a low-cost INS that needed periodic updates from a GPS
>>>
>>> I would not rule out that they simply made the drone fly into a big
>>> fishing net and dropped it with a parachute in a kind of controlled
>>> mid air collision.   Heck the US used to capture film cam falling from
>>> space with big nets
>>>
>>> Chris Albertson
>>> Redondo Beach, California
>>>
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