[time-nuts] Why do crystals go bad?

Shawn Tayler shawn at xmtservices.net
Tue Feb 15 03:54:10 UTC 2011


And sorry about the typos!  Still getting used to this touch screen!

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 14, 2011, at 19:47, Shawn Tayler <shawn at xmtservices.net> wrote:

> Very interesting Bob Thanks.
> 
> It brings to mind an annoying issue I run into from time to time.
> 
> VCXO 12.8 Mhz used as a reference in communications gear.  Most of the gear is roughly 10 years old and of similar make, both mobile and portable styles.  They all are dropping in operating frequency. Many as far as 3000 hz at 850 MHz but it does vary with most in the 1300 hz area.  The trim adjustment is made through a programming interface and in some cases we are running out of adjustment.
> 
> My question is what is the process in the aging if the crystals that causes this drop in frequency?  I understand it may be mechanical but the level if vibration the radios are exposed to varies greatly and there does not seem to be a correlation with the frequency shift we are seeing.
> 
> Just thought I start a discussion.  I thinks still soy of on topic?
> 
> Shawn
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Feb 14, 2011, at 5:02, Bob Camp <lists at rtty.us> wrote:
> 
>> Hi
>> 
>>> From a number of radios I've torn crystals out of and looked at:
>> 
>> 1) The blank is broken / cracked. Most likely the radio got dropped somewhere along the line. Just like that stone hit on your windshield (on two cars at the moment), the crack can start small and propagate. Time from impact to failure might be years. 
>> 
>> 2) Cement fractures. Except in pressure mounts, the blank is held in the holder (clips) with cement. Normally this both holds the part and makes electrical connection. Some epoxies shrink with time eventually they shrink enough to crack. Big enough crack at the wrong place = no electrical contact.
>> 
>> 3) Plating adhesion. Metal is deposited on the blank using a thin film process. If everything is nice and clean, and it's the right metal it sticks very nicely. If it's the wrong metal or stuff is dirty - not so much. Add to that (possibly high) drive and the metal comes off. Loose enough metal and it stops working. 
>> 
>> 4) Air in the package. On high performance / low frequency crystals (think 5 MHz 3rd), the parts run in vacuum. Let in air and the resistance goes up a lot. High resistance = no works. 
>> 
>> 5) Broken mounts. If you put enough vibration on a crystal for long enough, at the right frequency, you break the mounts. Often this is right where the mount hits the post coming up from the base. Happens mostly in mobile gear. You can do it with random vibe, but much easier to do with a sine at the right frequency. 
>> 
>> 6) Contamination. Put a fine layer of crud on the surface of a crystal and you can stop it dead. It acts as a mechanical damper, especially at low drive levels (like startup). 
>> 
>> ---------------
>> 
>> Stuff that you see in papers:
>> 
>> 7) Micro fractures. The machining process that makes the blank bashes away at the blank on a microscopic level. Stone to windshield on a micro scale. 
>> 
>> That's no where near a complete list, but it's a start. I have seen no convincing evidence of a wear out mechanism in a quartz resonator. Quartz is pretty sturdy stuff. There are lots of examples of parts older than I am still out there running. They do age on and on, they don't seem to die except when they are deliberately killed. 
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> On Feb 13, 2011, at 10:26 PM, Bill Hawkins wrote:
>> 
>>> Group,
>>> 
>>> Jim Garland on the boatanchors at theporch.com list asked about crystals:
>>> "A 22.5MHz crystal (HC-5 case) in my homebrew receiver, built about forty
>>> years ago, no longer oscillates. It seems to be purely an age-related
>>> problem.
>>> It is in a standard solid state circuit which bandswitches six crystals, and
>>> the other five work just fine.  I wonder what causes a crystal to stop
>>> working, and whether it is possible to repair them?  I've "repaired" dead
>>> 100kHz calibrator crystals, and hamband crystals in FT-243 cases, by
>>> cleaning off the brass pressure plates, but am not sure if one can do this
>>> on thin high crystals. As I recall, the metal electrodes are evaporated onto
>>> the sides of the element. 73, Jim W8ZR"
>>> 
>>> One of the replies was:
>>> "Broken families, drugs, drink... the normal, I suppose. John K5MO"
>>> 
>>> Scott Robinson asked: "Receiver crystals aren't getting beaten up by high
>>> power,
>>> but something has killed a lot of them in my R-390A and Drake R-4A.
>>> Curiously yours, Scott"
>>> 
>>> And Roy Morgan asked:
>>> "I have a 1960's frequency standard from a Nike site: the Sulzer Oscillator
>>> and would like to find tech into on it."
>>> 
>>> Any help appreciated.
>>> 
>>> Bill Hawkins
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>>> and follow the instructions there.
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
>> and follow the instructions there.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts at febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.




More information about the Time-nuts_lists.febo.com mailing list