[time-nuts] Tool Needed to Access my Timer Battery

J. Forster jfor at quik.com
Wed Feb 16 20:05:13 UTC 2011


AHA! The English system triumphs over that Metric nonsense.

My Rolex stopped working about 20 years ago. OTOH, my $12 Timex analog
quartz still works fine....

I think. At least it was working when I misplaced it a year ago. Since
then, I've discovered I really don't need to know time to much better than
+/- 10 minutes.

FWIW,

-John

==============


> I figured someone would pounce on my post.  If you think that time nuts
> can
> be competitive, try watch nuts.  None of us agrees with any of the rest of
> us, no matter what.
>
> It is true that the term ebauche, as it is used in the trade, very often
> refers to an incomplete movement.  It may or may not be fitted with
> jewels,
> springs, escapment, balance wheel.  The term is used loosely in the watch
> business except, of course, that each of us knows precisely how it should
> be
> used and everyone else is wrong.  [?]
>
> Ebauche is used in a less technical way to refer to a movement that is not
> built in-house but rather is purchased, more-or-less tweaked, and put into
> a
> house case.  It is sometimes (by Rolex fanbois, for example) used as a
> term
> of derision, as the use of an outsourced ebauche is considered to be less
> prestigious than building your own movements in house.  I'll leave that
> debate for another day.
>
> When an ebauche is outsourced, the assembler will specify what he wants to
> be supplied.  It can be anything from the plates and pillars all the way
> up
> to a fully assembled, ready-to-run movement.  The more upscale the
> assembler, the more likely they are to want to insert some of their own
> parts, do some fancy milling and engraving, etc., some to improve
> performance, some just to look sexy.  The Omega Seamaster that I am
> wearing
> at this moment (a 2255.80.00) uses the ETA 2892-A2 ebauche and modifies it
> extensively, then refers to it as either the Omega 1120 calibre or the
> 1120
> movement.
>
> All that being said, at least Omega (won't speak for others) refers to the
> uncased movement, when it goes to COSC for testing as an ebauche.  Whether
> they mean by that that they bought it from ETA or just that it is an
> uncased
> movement would be for them to answer.
>
> Chuck is right in pointing out that terminology should be used correctly
> which is why I wrote "ebauche et assortiments" which, in context, means
> "all
> the parts and pieces" of the movement.  And that covers it adequately
> whether the ebauche, itself, comes ready-to-run or just as a handful of
> components.
>
> He quite accurately corrects my use of the term "calibre" (yeah, we fuss
> over how to spell it, too...).  His definition, including both the
> measurement of the movement in lignes and the general configuration of the
> movement such that it will fit a specific case, is right on target.  It
> is,
> however, not uncommon to hear people say calibre to refer to a movement as
> a
> whole.  Omega, for example, refers in some  of its literature to the "1120
> calibre," by which they mean the whole movement.
>
> A ligne is 1/12 of an inch, by the way.
>
> And we could go on from here but you would probably rather get back to
> filtering that Tbolt power supply.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 11:38 AM, Chuck Harris <cfharris at erols.com> wrote:
>
>> I think if we are going to use terminology, we should try to use it
>> correctly.
>>
>> The term ebauche, is very similar to the term engine block.  An ebauche
>> is
>> an unfinished movement.  It typically has not been fitted with all of
>> the
>> jewels, balance, etc..  In Switzerland, like in Detroit, there are
>> numerous
>> companies, also known as Ebauche, that build the parts that many name
>> brand
>> manufacturers assemble into a finished unit... be it an engine, or a
>> watch.
>>
>> Just as a Volkeswagen Beetle, and a Porsche 914 use the same engine
>> block,
>> but finish it for different purposes, an ebauche movement may receive
>> quite
>> a lot of hot-rodding depending on the OEM customer.  Some get their
>> plates
>> dressed up with fine gilt lettering, Damasceening, extra jewels, and
>> adjustments,
>> and others simply get stuffed into the watch case rough and unadorned.
>>
>> The term calibre, is used two ways.  The first is to show the general
>> size
>> of a movement, in lignes.  The second is to indicate the general layout,
>> or
>> style of a movement.  Movements of the same calibre can often be
>> substituted
>> for an original movement, even though they are made, and finished,
>> differently
>> than the original.
>>
>> Companies like Rolex have traditionally done all of the manufacturing of
>> their
>> movements in house.  They do not use the Ebauche market as a source for
>> any
>> of
>> their parts.  Other companies, like TAG/Heuer use nothing but Ebauche
>> parts.
>>
>> Quartz movements as found in the typical Bling brands, are all ebauche.
>>
>> Mechanical watch movements have suffered greatly from the rapid
>> depression
>> of
>> the prices of sophisticated electronics, and the rapid rise of labor
>> costs.
>>
>> It was once possible for a watchmaker to spend his days fixing watches,
>> at
>> a reasonably cheap price, and still keep his wife and kids fed clothed,
>> and living in a decent home.
>>
>> But even back then, technology brought us the "Dollar Watch" that was so
>> cheap that it was never meant to be fixed.  The start of the downfall of
>> the watchmaking profession.
>>
>> Today, if a watchmaker charges $140 for a 3-4 hour service job, people
>> complain
>> that it is too expensive.  And yet, they would also complain if they
>> didn't
>> get
>> more than $140 for 3-4 hours of their time.
>>
>>
>> -Chuck Harris
>>
>> William H. Fite wrote:
>>
>>> That estimate is probably about right.  It hasn't been quite that
>>> expensive
>>> for me but then I have a couple of Omegas; gave my Rolex to my nephew
>>> years
>>> ago.
>>>
>>> For your money, they remove the movement (or the calibre...or the
>>> ébauche
>>> et
>>> assortiments...depending on how horologically snooty you care to be.
>>> They
>>> clean it, inspect it and replace worn parts, reassemble and lubricate.
>>>  They
>>> then test it for accuracy in their own lab.  If it passes house
>>> standards,
>>> they will send the movement (still out of the case at this point) to
>>> the
>>> Contrôle Officiel Suisse des Chronomètres where it will be tested for a
>>> number of days, in a number of positions, at a number of temperatures.
>>> Assuming it passes, they put it back into the case, which has, in the
>>> meantime, been cleaned, repaired if needed, and buffed.  They then ship
>>> the
>>> watch back to you with a new warranty and a new COSC chronometer
>>> certification.
>>>
>>> Considering that the bottom end for a Rolex nowadays is on the order of
>>> $3K
>>> and even a lowly Omega Seamaster starts at about $1500, this fee does
>>> not
>>> seem excessive to me.
>>>
>>> Of course, if'n you don't care, just take it to your local Kay's.
>>> After
>>> all, every kiss begins with Kay.  But understand that the kiss you get
>>> will
>>> be kissing your fine movement goodbye much before its time.
>>>
>>> But I wouldn't pay that to have a quartz watch overhauled.  That is the
>>> care
>>> you give to a fine mechanical calibre, not a crystal and a battery.
>>> After
>>> all (shudder) it is quartz.  Quartz belongs on the bench, not on your
>>> wrist.  Some Rolex owners are ashamed to admit that Rolex even makes a
>>> quartz watch.  If I had a pricey quartz watch and it failed, I'd
>>> probably
>>> just have a new quartz movement from Seiko or whoever slapped into my
>>> expensive case and get on with my life.
>>>
>>> Those of you who no longer wear wrist watches and have some in your
>>> dresser
>>> drawers with mechanical movements, feel free to send them to me.  I'll
>>> sort
>>> out the wheat from the chaff.[?]
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>
>>
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