[time-nuts] GPS Spoofing

Scott McGrath scmcgrath at gmail.com
Tue Jul 30 00:33:18 UTC 2013


I'm not for prohibiting ownership of as that would break a lot of companies test programs including the one I work for as we have a spirent in a cage to test LTE systems. And every avionics shop would be out of business

But if the FCC catches someone USING a jammer to  access to GPS i dont have a problem with FCC throwing book at miscreant 

There is a big difference between unintentional interference and actively disrupting the only publically available precision navigation and time source

Keep a jammer up long enough near a cell tower and you can bring tower down as well.  Where do you think all those Tbolts come from.  And because of GPS you no longer need a Cs reference in the CO for clock as you have all those flying clocks up there

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 29, 2013, at 12:23 PM, "J. Forster" <jfor at quikus.com> wrote:

> Prohibition never works. It's been tried with booze, drugs, pay sex, and
> guns, at least, and failed every time.
> 
> If people want something badly enough, they will get it.
> 
> Ask yourself, is the collateral damage worth it?
> 
> MMV,
> 
> -John
> 
> =================
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> We've been discussing both GNSS denial/spoofing vs Loran denial/spoofing
>> and the relative difficulty of doing same to determine which system is
>> most survivable
>> 
>> That being said the penalty for using the truck stop/spy shop GPS should
>> be in the hundreds of thousands per day and carry serious jail time. As
>> most of them are easily capable of affecting a square mile as if you look
>> at the specs from their Chinese suppliers.
>> 
>> If you want to keep your boss from finding that you spent more than
>> allocated time eating lunch just wrap the antenna in Al foil
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Jul 29, 2013, at 1:12 AM, "Fuqua, Bill L" <wlfuqu00 at uky.edu> wrote:
>> 
>>> The idea behind GPS spoofing is that one or several surface antennas
>>> and sources could be set up in such a way that they would produce
>>> believable position data that would take a vessel off course. The
>>> problem with this concept is that the person in charge of the GPS
>>> spoofing hardware has to know exactly where the vessel is at all times
>>> to start with and other vessels some distance away, and not very far
>>> from the target vessel would get contradicting signals from the virtual
>>> satellites.
>>> Software could be used to detect changes in position data that is
>>> inconsistent with present course and recent data. And in most cases
>>> there would be a period of very inconsistent signals from satellites and
>>> more obvious, signal strengths.
>>> Another way to limit spoofing is to use directional antennas that
>>> prevent reception from near horizon signals. Or detect low angle signals
>>> and sound the alarm or implement a means of ignoring those sources.
>>> The problem very high tech systems are often defeated by low tech
>>> solutions. Successful GPS spoofing would be very high tech.
>>> Many high tech systems that the government had developed in the past
>>> have been defeated by low tech methods. An example is the microwave
>>> system that is intended to turn back rioters by inducing burning pain.
>>> It was defeated by using thick wooden shields which absorbed the RF
>>> energy.
>>> Human resourcefulness and determination often defeats technology in low
>>> tech ways. And the more complex a system is the easier it is to defeat.
>>> “The more they overtake the plumbing the easier it is to stop up the
>>> drain.”
>>> Most discussions have been about wireless spoofing. However, the most
>>> reliable way to do it would be an “inside job” where a device would
>>> be put on board and patched in the antenna lead. The correct GPS data
>>> would be received by the device and then it would produce a virtual
>>> constellation of satellites that would direct the vessel off course.
>>> However, the programmer would have to know the course that the pilot
>>> intended to take in the first place if his goal is to
>>> take the vessel to a different destination.
>>> 73
>>> Bill wa4lav
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