[time-nuts] Lucent KS-24361, HP/Symmetricom Z3809A, Z3810A, Z3811A, Z3812...

Sun Nov 2 02:36:26 UTC 2014

That's one down side of course of only buying the REF-1 units, not  having 
any idea of the "normal" behaviour.

It's certainly sounding like any hopes of a purely passive  solution is one 
for the "wishful thinking" department. I'd still like to  minimise any 
internal modifications, and mounting Arthur's switching circuit  inside a 
connector body wouldn't be difficult, so will still check to see  if there's any 
way of routing power out via the 15 way connector.
That still leaves the fault light connection but I was pretty sure  I've 
already established that just holding that input high to match the  fault 
light would enable it to start up ok but fiddling with it just now I'm  back to 
a fault light and not outputs.
Perhaps I should have left well alone:-)

Regards

Nigel
GM8PZR

In a message dated 02/11/2014 02:00:23 GMT Standard Time, kb8tq at n1k.org  
writes:

Hi

I’ve watched the two boxes fire up. They spend a bit of  time blinking 
lights on this one and then on that one. From watching the  “dance”, I think 
that the transistor delay circuit (or something like it) is  indeed needed. 
There are multiple ways the delay and sequencing could be  implemented. A 
cheap 5V PIC is certainly one way to do it. With no voltage  coming out on the 
connector doing a purely external solution probably is going  to require 
external power. I think I’d at least bring that out on one of the  many unused 
alarm pins. 

Bob

> On Nov 1, 2014, at 9:52 PM,  GandalfG8--- via time-nuts 
<time-nuts at febo.com> wrote:
> 
>  Hi Bob,
> 
> I understand the consequences of not modifying the  unit but, having done 
so 
> and having a REF-1 unit running stand alone,  I was just commenting that 
I 
> wasn't  sure whether or not it was  necessary to implement all of 
Arthur's  
> modification in order to  enable the basic functionality, or whether some 

> part of it  might be purely to control the indicators.
> 
> As a follow on  from that I was wondering whether or not it might  be 
> possible  to achieve a similar result, at least to the point of just 
making it   
> functional, just by cross linking some of the out and return  paths,  
"faking" 
> it without the need for an additional powered  interface if you  like, 
not for 
> any other reason than it might  then be possible to make  a plug in 
> modification that could be  fitted without needing to  open the box.
> 
> Regards
>  
> Nigel
> GM8PZR
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a  message dated 02/11/2014 00:19:57 GMT Standard Time, kb8tq at n1k.org  

> writes:
> 
> Hi
> 
> If you:
> 
>  1) Do not have two units (Ref 0 and Ref  1)
> 
> — and  —
> 
> 2) Do not “fake out” the slave detect (= use the   mod)
> 
> Then the unit you have will not:
> 
> 1)  Enable the pps  out
> 
> 2) Enable the 15 MHz out
>  
> It will try to disciple the OCXO,  but you won’t be able to see  any 
result 
> of that.
> 
> Bob
> 
>  
>> On  Nov 1, 2014, at 7:05 PM, GandalfG8--- via time-nuts  
> <time-nuts at febo.com>  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi  Anthony,
>> 
>> It's a new circuit that  has to be  inserted, which is what I've done, 
but 
> 
>> I'm not  sure  whether or not it's strictly necessary for the unit to 
>  function 
>> or  whether it's just there to get the lights  sequencing properly and  
>> perhaps all  that's needed for  basic functionality are just the  links.
>> 
>> I'm  leaving well alone for now to let the oscillator  run overnight but 

>> will try it again tomorrow with just the  links and see what  happens.
>> I'm also hoping to get some idea of the  between  unit signalling,  
> although 
>> I only have Z3811s  I'm  hoping, with the boards being an almost  
> identical  
>> match, that  what goes one way should be matched by what  comes the  
other.
>> 
>> Regards
>>  
>> Nigel
>> GM8PZR
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> In a message dated 01/11/2014 22:41:09 GMT Standard Time,   
> aroby at antamy.com  
>> writes:
>> 
>>  I wasn't  clear  from the photo whether the circuit was a  
representation 
> of 
>> what is  on  the board, and  you just had to connect the pins listed 
> together,  
>>  or whether  this was a new circuit that had to be  inserted.   Sounds 
like 
>> the  latter?
>> 
>>  Anthony
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>>  From:  time-nuts  [mailto:time-nuts-bounces at febo.com] On Behalf Of  
>> GandalfG8--- via  time-nuts
>> Sent: Saturday,  November 01, 2014  4:04 PM
>> To:   time-nuts at febo.com
>> Subject: Re: [time-nuts]  Lucent KS-24361,  HP/Symmetricom  Z3809A, 
> Z3810A, 
>> Z3811A,   Z3812...
>> 
>> Well, I'm happy to report that   Arthur's  modification does do the 
trick, 
>> although I don't  know why as I  don't  have any data for the interface  
>  as yet.
>> I daren't  disturb the 15 pin  connector right  now as this  Z3811A PCB 
is 
> 
>> still out of its case  and  connected to a breadboard  with  wires just 
>  pushed 
>> into the sockets, and  for the same reason I   don't have  any computer 
>> connection at the  moment   either.
>> 
>> My implementation isn't  quite as described, in that  I've not  made a 
>>  connection to the fault LED but am just  manually pulling that  input  
> high and low 
>> on the breadboard with   another wire link as required.
>> Whether  or not this is part  or  all of the reason that my green "on"  
> light  
>> is  flashing  rather than steady I don't know, but I am  seeing the 1PPS 
> and 
>> 15MHz  outputs and the 15MHz  looks to be conditioning ok.
>> 
>> Aside from the 5   volt supply, which I'm picking off from pin 5  of the 
>> header  between u33 and  U34, and the aforementioned fault  LED 
>  connection, all 
>> the  other  connections can be made  to  J5 externally and could be 
housed 
> in a 
>> 15   way  shell along  with the switching circuits.
>>  
>> I'm still hopeful that  some  cross linking of the  right pairs might  
>> achieve the  same result  without  the extra circuitry, so "all" that 
> needs to   be  
>> done now is just to  identify the right  pairs:-)
>> 
>> At least with it up and running it  should  be easier to check  out some 

> of 
>>  the inter-unit signalling.
>> 
>> Thanks  Arthur, your  efforts are much  appreciated.
>> 
>>  regards
>> 
>> Nigel
>> GM8PZR
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> In  a message dated  01/11/2014 15:25:02 GMT Standard  Time,  
> aroby at antamy.com
>> writes:
>>  
>> For  those who missed it, Arthur's  post is  at  
>>  https://www.febo.com/pipermail/time-nuts/2010-June/047825.html  and   
the 
> photo  is at  
>> 
>  
http://i906.photobucket.com/albums/ac262/rjb1998/RFTG-uREF1photo1_zps87c505ca.jpg
>>  
>> Anthony
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> -----Original   Message-----
>> From:  time-nuts  [mailto:time-nuts-bounces at febo.com] On  Behalf  Of  
> Arthur 
>> Dent
>> Sent: Friday, October 31, 2014  9:20  PM
>> To:   time-nuts at febo.com
>>  Subject: [time-nuts] Lucent KS-24361,   HP/Symmetricom  Z3809A,  
Z3810A, 
>> Z3811A, Z3812A GPSDO  system
>>  
>> Bob  Stewart bob at  evoria.net
>> ?? ?   I have both of my units sitting on the  bench. I found that  I   
> needed 
>> to connect them together to get the REF1   unit to come  out of standby  
? 
> . ??
>>  
>> Bob Camp kb8tq at   n1k.org
>> ??I suspect  that somebody will have  to figure out what  the 15  pin  
>> connector / jumper is doing. On previous RFTG   units  there was a way  
to 
> re-wire 
>> the crossover interface  to  fake out the slave  detect process.  That 
> would  let 
>> you run  a single GPS equipped box and have it   behave  correctly. 
> Without  
>> the fake wires  trick none of them played nice  without  the  slave 
being  
>> present ? 
>> .   ??
>>  ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>> Reposting what I  had   posted  over a week ago, in case you missed it ? 
 .
>> 
>> Arthur Dent  golgarfrincham  at gmail.com  Wed Oct 22 13:59:48 EDT  2014 

> ?? 
>> ?   
>> Way back on Fri Jun 11  16:48:43  UTC 2010 I posted  about using one of  
>> these units I had modified   but  at the time there wasn't a single 
person 
> who 
>>  was  interested. I have been using  the RFTG-u REF1 since then and  it  
is 
> a 
>> nice unit. The modifications I added   (including a power  supply -see  
> photo) 
>> allows  the lights to cycle through  their  normal sequence on  warm-up  
> and the 
>> second unit  isn't needed at all ?  .   ??
>> 
>> -Arthur
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