[time-nuts] Cesium Clock Avialable

Bob kb8tq kb8tq at n1k.org
Sat May 19 14:18:53 EDT 2018


Hi

Ok …. errr …. shipping …. about that. 

Cs is classified rightly as a hazardous substance. Transporting and shipping 
hazardous stuff is indeed regulated (as it should be). For various silly reasons
the minute amount of Cs inside a virtually indestructible container in a Cs 
standard  falls into the hazardous category. 

So, to properly ship a Cs standard, you need to be properly trained and certified
as a Hazmat shipper. You then need to register that training certificate with your 
favorite shipper and verify that they accept the certificate. They then come out 
and check your paperwork system to be sure it’s up to the proper standards. 
Once all that is accomplished you can originate a shipment of a Cs standard. 
Yes, there are a couple of fees involved in all that. 

If all that sounds trivial or easy …. it’s not. Figure on a coupe of months to get
it all done. Once you do get it all done you can put a nice big Hazmat label on
the package and ship it out ( with of course an added charge for handling
the rest of the process ). If you do it once you at least will know what is needed 
for the annual renewal of certification and re-inspection process. ( and the fees
involved ….)

So ….errrr …. yes. The bottom line is that even if a railroad locomotive hits
the UPS truck, you aren’t going to get Cs all over the place. The risk of actually
hurting anybody with Cs is essentially zero. This whole shipping process is 
probably not as risky as crossing the street when the “don’t walk” sign is flashing. 

Be aware though that if you are shipping one and label it as a Cs standard, ( without
all the proper Hazmat shipping certifications )  you may get into all sorts of nonsense. 
If somebody spots it ( and that has happened ) your package is not going to get delivered. 
If it is in transit when noticed ( = they already accepted it) It probably is not going to get 
returned to you. I’d bet you at least get a bill for disposing of it ….

Equally if you ship one and don’t do it properly there is a slight chance of it getting 
noticed ( think in terms of a damaged box that gets attended to ) …. at that point 
all sorts of nasty legal sorts of things could happen.

Just another of life’s little pieces of excitement ….

Bob

> On May 19, 2018, at 1:36 PM, paul swed <paulswedb at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Bobs
> Comments are on target.
> The Cesium can last a long time on the shelf. But (Always a but) other
> stuff in the tube tends to pollute the tube.
> This causes the high current when you start the system that may or may not
> clear up.Some great time-nuts threads on the subject and how to attempt to
> recover the tube.
> 
> In my experience after the tubes up and running and in a locked state. The
> beam current is relative. About 20-40 is good.
> The issue is there are some settings that can totally fake this reading out
> like the meter sensitivity. As the current goes down you see more of the
> noise floor of the system that deteriorates the quality. Funny fact
> Frankenstein 5060/61 mix has barely originally showed .5 on the beam
> current. Yet still locks. Today beam current is 0 and its still locks. The
> tube was deemed dead when it was given to me. In comparing it to another
> much later 5061 it is indeed locked nicely.
> 
> The option 004 tubes run hot and consume Cs more rapidly. Dead 004 tubes
> are pretty much dead.
> 
> As I recall in the manual there is a way to directly read the true beam
> current (If you actually have any) right off the tube.
> So some lucky sole in this tread will finally have a real ticking clock.
> Congrats and have fun. I think the darn clocks go for as much as Doug is
> asking. Shipping was about $130 or so from Az to Ma about a year ago when I
> picked up my 2nd 5061.
> I think this is a bit cheap as it came from a company that most likely gets
> a discount we don't.
> 
> Regards
> Paul
> WB8TSL
> 
> 
> On Sat, May 19, 2018 at 1:02 PM, Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On May 19, 2018, at 11:22 AM, Dana Whitlow <k8yumdoober at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Don't Cesium clocks have a beam current integrator of sorts so that it's
>>> possible
>>> to pretty accurately assess the remaining life of the tube?  If not, I'm
>>> terribly
>> 
>> Simple answer - no. The ones we are playing with came out *long* before
>> you could do
>> anything like that in a practical way. Even today I know of no atomic
>> standard made by
>> anybody that does something like that.
>> 
>> 
>>> surprised and disappointed.
>>> 
>>> Also, beginning with a new tube, roughly how long can one be run until it
>>> reaches exhaustion?  Are we speaking months, years, decades, or what?
>> 
>> 
>> Rated life on a high performance tube is in the 5 to 7 year range. I have
>> indeed proven that
>> to be correct with a couple of tubes run on a 24/7/365 basis. A “standard
>> grade” tube should
>> run for 2 or 3 times that long. A lot depends on exactly which model tube
>> from what era and
>> who made the specific tube.
>> 
>> Tubes are not the only thing that dies in a Cs standard. The older ones (
>> = what we play with)
>> are mostly full of leaded parts described in manuals and schematics. They
>> may not all be made
>> anymore, but various substitutes are out there. Also, chassis for Cs
>> standards with dead
>> tubes are pretty common. It’s the tubes we are most likely to run out of ….
>> 
>> Of course you *can* get a nice new tube from the factory. Last time I did
>> that the bill was
>> about $38,000. That included them putting it in.
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>>> 
>>> Dana
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sat, May 19, 2018 at 10:01 AM, Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi
>>>> 
>>>> Unfortunately there really is no way to tell how much Cs is left in the
>>>> tube. You can
>>>> look at beam current and make a guess. All that really will tell you is
>>>> that the fuel
>>>> gauge is on empty or at least just off of empty.
>>>> 
>>>> Bob
>>>> 
>>>>> On May 19, 2018, at 2:30 AM, Paul Bicknell <paul at bicknells.f2s.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Doug
>>>>> 
>>>>> Is it possible to test its operation and
>>>>> can the time left on the cesium be calculated   Regards Paul
>>>>> 
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: time-nuts [mailto:time-nuts-bounces at febo.com] On Behalf Of Doug
>>>> Millar
>>>>> via time-nuts
>>>>> Sent: 19 May 2018 05:04
>>>>> To: time-nuts at febo.com
>>>>> Subject: [time-nuts] Cesium Clock Avialable
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi, I am willing to part with my HP 5061A cesium standard and manual.
>> The
>>>>> unit was rebuilt and functioning some years ago and not used since
>> then.
>>>>> There is usable cesium in the tube and the unit worked. I have not
>>>> tested it
>>>>> recently. It has a Patek-Philippe analogue clock in the front. The unit
>>>> is
>>>>> in great physical condition.  Asking $600 plus shipping from Long
>> Beach,
>>>> CA.
>>>>> 90806
>>>>> I also have an ESI 242D resistance calibrator and a Julie primary
>>>> resistance
>>>>> standard in an oven. Let me know if you are interested. Very
>> reasonable.
>>>>>    Thanks, Doug K6JEY
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
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