[time-nuts] HP5071A with bad tube.... can I get one used?

[Bob kb8tq]

Hi

No idea about how well things work if you swap a “normal” tube into a 
“high performance” chassis. One would *guess* that there are numbers
somewhere relating to beam current. The high performance tubes run
a (much) higher beam current than the standard tubes. Since that drops 
off towards end of life, no idea if the settings are significant or not. 

It is not unusual to go through a half dozen or a dozen “eBay wonders” to
find one that works That’s not just true of Cs standards. It applies to a lot of used
Time Nut gear. Indeed there is a difference between doing repairs on this or
that and a dead Cs tube that is not repairable. 

At the prices 5071’s seem to go for, it might be cheaper to just send it back 
to the factory for a new tube :)

Bob

> On Oct 24, 2019, at 4:11 PM, Taka Kamiya <tkamiya9 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> I bought this HP5071A knowing it didn't lock and paid very little for it.  I think I'll keep it for a while hoping another one shows up.  I know there is a ROM in the tube with serial number and a poem.  Do you know if the unit starts its life as high performance unit, does it have to stay that way?  If non-high-performance unit shows up, can they be mixed and matched somehow?
> 
> I do have a "limping along" FTS4040A that still locks.  But its an old unit.  I'm still trying to verify its performance, but even in best of case scenario, it's an order or two behind standard version of HP5071A.
> --------------------------------------- 
> (Mr.) Taka Kamiya
> KB4EMF / ex JF2DKG
> 
> 
> On Thursday, October 24, 2019, 2:23:39 PM EDT, Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi
> 
> Based on running a high performance tube version of the 5071A for a number of years, the
> tubes last about 5 to 7 years when run 24/7/365. Once they die, the practical ($$$$$$$)
> alternative is to send the beast back to the factory for a new tube. Indeed given the price
> and the complexity of shipping (it’s a hazmat item), this is only practical if you are a company
> that needs to use the device. 
> 
> At least on the high performance 5071, the “end of life” process is not an immediate death sort of
> thing. The stability (ADEV) of the device degrades as the tube wears out. If you have a stability 
> requirement (not just function) the wear out point will be a bit earlier than the numbers above.
> Just how much earlier depends a bit on how picky you are. ( = if you high performance tube is 
> worse than a standard tube, how happy are you?) You also would need the gear to test the ADEV. 
> 
> Some of what’s in the 5071A is running based on firmware and settings shot in here and there
> on the device. Updating / adjusting / tweaking those settings has not been documented out
> here “in the wild” AFIK. The factory (obviously) does understand how to tweak this or that. 
> The degree to which tweaks might be needed with this or that unusual tube is very much 
> open to debate.
> 
> The whole “can’t get a tube” issue is hardly unique to the 5071A. I have a pair of Cs standards
> in the basement. Both have tube issues. One may be repairable if I ever get around to playing
> with the fix. Once “fixed” will it run for another few months or a few more years? There is no way
> to know without trying it. 
> 
> Will this or that tube last a month, a year or two or a decade or thee? I know of no external test that will
> guarantee a decade of capacity. There are indeed tests that will suggest that you are limping along. 
> Most (but not all) basement Cs standards are in the “limping along” category. As with the 5071, 
> just what constitutes limping along, depends a bit on how close to (or how much better than) the 
> factory spec you need to be.
> 
> Bob
> 
> > On Oct 23, 2019, at 11:42 PM, Taka Kamiya via time-nuts <time-nuts at lists.febo.com <mailto:time-nuts at lists.febo.com>> wrote:
> > 
> > I have an HP5071A with a high performance option that does not work.  All of my tests indicate the faulty component is a tube itself.  Buying a new tube is way out of my budget.  I am now torn between parting it out and see what I can use and keeping it intact with hope something might pop up.  
> > 
> > Question for the group....  Obtaining a used tube for this, I don't care if its high performance or not, as long as it works with the chassis, is really not a possibility, correct?  I have never seen one on eBay.
> > 
> > --------------------------------------- 
> > (Mr.) Taka Kamiya
> > KB4EMF / ex JF2DKG
> 
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