[time-nuts] Cutler NAA on 24.0kHz....

Bob Camp kb8tq at n1k.org
Sun Aug 17 20:23:39 EDT 2014


Hi

You have a Cs to work with *plus* the pollution that comes from propagation and what ever is going on with your antenna and their antenna. Since you are dealing with phase to get anything useful, a swing in their (100 Hz wide) antenna could give you a pretty significant phase change when looking 1x10^-9 sort of level. 

How much any of that’s enhanced by recovering modulation - don’t know. Does NAA have a twice daily dropout like WWVB? - don’t know. 

Bob

On Aug 17, 2014, at 3:30 PM, paul swed <paulswedb at gmail.com> wrote:

> OK
> Couple of comments
> NAA is 24KHz
> Jim Creek is 24.8 as I recall. Anyhow westies might want Jim Creek in Wa.
> I can here both on the east coast day or night with nothing spectacular at
> all.
> 
> That said I shared the tracor d-msk-r circuit with the group that removes
> the msk. How does it pull that trick off? I do not get how it gets rid of
> the msk and leaves the carrier.
> 
> To Bobs comment. Interesting about the code. But with MSK removed you at
> least have a CS reference to work with. It ain't wwvb, but for the
> simplicity of it that would be very positive design for low cost.
> 
> Regards
> Paul
> WB8TSL
> 
> 
> On Sun, Aug 17, 2014 at 2:50 PM, Bob Camp <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi
>> 
>> If you are going with an NAA receiver for frequency and time, I would not
>> strip off the modulation. Recover it, time tag it once a second and work
>> out a way to compare sequences between observers. If they are (still)
>> transmitting random looking “stuff” the one second signatures should be
>> reasonably unique. Net result would be getting “everything" (time ticks and
>> frequency) from NAA that you would have from WWVB.
>> 
>> Coverage area is pretty good. You should be able to get a wide range of
>> people involved.
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
>> On Aug 17, 2014, at 2:23 PM, Kenneth G. Gordon <kgordon2006 at frontier.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 17 Aug 2014 at 7:52, Burt I. Weiner wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Gang,
>>>> 
>>>> Just for fun I just tried to see if I could hear the signal on 24 kHz
>>>> using my GPS referenced HP-3586B and a HP-3336A also GPS locked to
>>>> compare the I.F. frequency using a 1:1 Lissajou pattern.  It's 7:30
>>>> AM here in Los Angeles.  I heard a signal but I doubt that it was
>>>> NAA.
>>> 
>>> Isn't NAA on 24.6 Khz? I am not certain of the frequency.
>>> 
>>>> What time of the day would be best, probably when the entire
>>>> path is dark?
>>> 
>>> In my experience, here in North Idaho, and when I was in Missoula, MT,
>>> athough the signal level rose and fell with diurnal variations in the
>> amount or
>>> lack of sunlight, it was ALWAYS there...at least as long as the
>> transmitter
>>> was in operation.
>>> 
>>>> My antenna is a dipole about 30-feet on a side, which
>>>> is really all I've got up at the moment.  It's orientation favors
>>>> that part of the country.  I hear WWVB at 60 kHz almost all the time
>>>> with that antenna.  WWVB is quite recognizable because of the phase
>>>> shift signature as seen on my X-Y display.
>>> 
>>> If you are hearing WWVB, you most CERTAINLY will hear NAA...if they are
>>> on the air.
>>> 
>>> Into my location here, NAA is at least three times as strong as WWVB.
>>> 
>>> Ken W7EKB
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